Have you decided to start bitcoin mining in South Africa? Are you wanting to make lots of money mining bitcoin? You might need think carefully about how much money you are willing to risk, as bitcoin mining is a very risky business.

(Please also see our articles on Cloud Mining and Mining schemes in South Africa, and bitcoin schemes in South Africa)

After getting countless emails and cries for help from people who have tried and failed at bitcoin mining, this article is to warn people that while you can make money, you can also lose a lot of money.

Everyone writes posts about why you should mine bitcoin, so this one is about why maybe you should not….a little balance is good 🙂

New users of bitcoin are the most excited about possibly earning a living from mining bitcoin, or even just to have it as another stream of income. The reality is though, that bitcoin mining is expensive, requires adequate technical knowledge of bitcoin and the mining process, as well as some level of computer skills and possible troubleshooting or problem solving skills.

you can tell if someone is new to bitcoin, if they ask you how they can start mining bitcoin.

Bitcoin mining is kind of the digital equivalent of the analog mining for gold. In the old days, if you were a gold miner, and were lucky, you could make a fortune. The problem was then that everybody decided to also start mining gold, and soon all the easy to find gold was gone. The harder to find gold was deeper in the ground or rock, or needed bigger and more specialized equipment to mine it.

This is sort of the same with bitcoin mining. The easy to get bitcoins were mined years ago when you could use your laptop or home computer to mine a few bitcoins a day. These days you need the top of the range ASIC miners to stand a chance of mining any bitcoin, and they dont come cheap, or with a guarantee of being profitable. This is especially true since the bitcoin halving, when mining profitability was cut in half, an event that happens roughly every 4 years.

Calculating profitability

No matter how much bitcoin you can mine each day, and how much it is worth, you are not profitable until you have earned MORE bitcoin than you have spent on your hardware, electricity, internet, or any other costs you might have like rent, customs fees, or even petrol. You need to FIRST cover the cost of your mining hardware and all running costs before you are profitable.

Profit calculator websites on the internet generally do not offer the full picture, and many times they are completely wrong. The amount of bitcoin you mine each day is generally on a constant downward trend due to the increases in the mining difficulty. Most profit calculators will tell you what you can earn with bitcoin mining today, and then they multiply that figure by days over time, without reducing the daily amount of bitcoin you earn due to the mining difficulty increases.

The fact is that your mining hardware will generate LESS and LESS bitcoin over time. Every time the bitcoin difficulty increases (it is recalculated roughly every 14 days), you generate less bitcoin, and therefore less profit. Once the bitcoin you are generating each day is worth less than your running costs, its time to turn off the bitcoin miner as it would be cheaper for you to just buy bitcoin. You need to have already covered the cost of your mining hardware and all other costs by this time, otherwise you would have made a loss.

Most miners only realize they might not get a return on their investment when it is too late, because in the beginning, the first 6 months or so, the profits look good. After the 6 month window, the declines in profit are far more noticeable.

Most computer hardware has a lifespan of around 3 to 5 years, and bitcoin miners are much shorter than that. You would be lucky to get 2 years of no problems or parts needing to be replaced, even the manufacturers themselves only offer a 90 day warranty on the hardware which does not instill confidence it will last for a very long time.

Bitcoin difficulty affects your profit

Bitcoin difficulty

The increase in the bitcoin difficulty over the last 2 years

A major curve ball in the profitability of bitcoin mining, is the ‘bitcoin difficulty’. If blocks are being mined quicker than every 10 minutes, the difficulty is adjusted, making it harder to mine bitcoin. The more miners there are, the higher the hash rate, and the quicker the blocks are mined. This results in the difficulty getting adjusted to be harder, to keep the block generation time at 10 minutes per block. So the higher the difficulty goes, the less profit you make.

This year alone, there has been some large jumps in the difficulty recalculation every 2016 blocks (roughly every 14 days). Below is a chart showing the changes in the difficulty so far this year. The Change column shows you how much the difficulty has gone up (green) or down (red) in 2016.

The difficulty going up 7.67% on 15 August means as a miner, you earn 7.67% LESS bitcoin from that moment onward, and are that much less profitable. This is a big problem for you if you still need to cover your costs, and every 2 weeks you are 6% less, 3% less, etc. On average, the difficulty goes up….there might be some occasional times when it goes down, but usually its up, meaning less profit.

bitcoin difficulty 2016 increases

When it comes to the bitcoin difficulty, there is not really any way to be sure what the change will be month to month, so how can you work out how profitable you will be in 6 months time? The answer is you don’t really, some miners will take the average difficulty increase over time over a few months and apply that number to their calculations to work out future profits. This is a huge gamble to take, and is also affected by the price of bitcoin.

If the price of bitcoin skyrockets, then it is suddenly more profitable, and many more miners suddenly turn on their previously unprofitable miners to make a few bucks. This again, means the difficulty will adjust accordingly, and in a short while, things are back to what they were again. Often you can see the correlation in the difficulty increases and decreases with the price of bitcoin.

How much does it cost to run bitcoin mining hardware?

electricity price south africa

Electricity prices in South Africa from 1 April 2016

One of the current popular bitcoin miners out there is the ANTMINER S9 11.85TH/s bitcoin miner, currently selling for around $1442 or around R21000 on the manufacturers website and around R45000 locally in South Africa. This miner uses a 1500W power supply and needs to be running 24 hours a day, so costs a lot to run.

Depending on what your total monthly use what you pay per kWh is on a sliding scale, but you will probably be on the top end of the sliding scale once you start mining bitcoin!

1500 W consumes 1.5kWh per hour, so 1.5 kWh x 24 hours a day x 30 (average-ish days in a month) = 1080 kWh per month in electricity consumption for this miner, give or take a little.

The price of electricity varies in South Africa, but the guideline average including VAT is 147.50 c/kWh. So using this guideline average with the amount of electricity the miner will use, you can say 1080kWh per month x 145.50 per kWh / 100 = around R1600 per month in electricity costs. Your cost could be more or less depending on what you pay per kWh.

Unless you have a lot of money to keep putting into your mining operation, you will most likely need to sell all the bitcoin you mine immediately to cover your costs of electricity. This can also be problematic if the price of bitcoin is fluctuating, and you get less than expected, but it can also help if the price is up and you get more than expected.

Most mining pools that you join when you start mining bitcoin charge you a fee, for example a popular bitcoin mining pool called F2Pool charges 3% fee of your profits. This also needs to be accounted for when you are working out how long it will take you to get your return on investment.

How profitable is the Antminer S9 11.85TH in South Africa?

Bitcoin minerThe Antminer S9 11.85TH bitcoin miner is able to mine in the region of between 0.4BTC and 0.45 BTC per month at the current bitcoin difficulty. So at a current Rand value of around R9000 per bitcoin, that means you will be mining bitcoin to the value of about R4500 for the first month (If we are being generous).

This amount will decrease gradually each month as the bitcoin difficulty increases. The bigger the jumps in bitcoin difficulty, the bigger the cuts in your mining profits.

Factor in the cost of the bitcoin miner into the equation too now. Based on previous price we used for electricity, your costs for the miner and electricity for a year would be at least R45000 + (R1600 x 12) = R64200, not including internet, mining pool fees etc.

If you were mining bitcoin to the value of R4500 per month for a year, you would have R4500 x 12 = R54000. Of course you would not be making exactly R4500 every month as over time that amount would be decreasing with each increase in the bitcoin difficulty.

It is quite possible and likely that it would take you over a year to break even, if you are lucky enough to break even. Sometimes big jumps in the bitcoin difficulty force miners to stop mining and sell their hardware before they have broken even in an effort to stop their losses.

Sometimes unforeseen problems can mean you will never break even, such as increases in the price of electricity, forced down time with load shedding which causes loss in mining time and profits, increased costs of generators or other hardware to make your mining operation work better, hardware failure, replacements and repairs to hardware etc.

What happens if the price of bitcoin skyrockets

bad luck brian bitcoin memeIf the price of bitcoin goes up drastically, then technically, the value of the bitcoin you are mining is worth more! This will work for you if you paid for your bitcoin miner using a credit card, or bank transfer. Every day when you sell your bitcoin to cover your electricity costs etc, you will be able to cover those costs and more of the cost of the miner faster!

This will not work in your favour if you paid for your bitcoin miner using BTC! If you paid 5 bitcoin for your bitcoin miner for example, and now the price of bitcoin skyrockets, you might be making more money in Rand value than the bitcoin was worth when you bought the miner, but if you had simply kept those bitcoin, you would have more Rand value in your pocket. The problem with this is also that if you are selling your mined bitcoin each day to cover costs, then if the price skyrockets over night, you can only benefit on the new price with the new bitcoin you mine.

Some people are who believe the price of bitcoin will go up, think that it is a wiser investment to therefore not spend it, and rather keep your bitcoin for that future date. The theory is that by simply investing the money you would have used for a miner into buying bitcoin, you will save yourself the hassle and stress of mining bitcoin and possibly not breaking even. You will not have worries or problems with electricity, internet, hardware problems and troubleshooting, noise and heat from the miners, buying and selling bitcoin to cover costs and possibly losing a lot of money.

By just investing in buying bitcoin, you are also able to sell your bitcoin at any time to get back your investment instantly, while with mining, you are stuck, and dont have a cent profit until you have covered all your costs.

If the price of bitcoin skyrockets while you are holding bitcoins, you will have a lot more value in your pocket immediately, while if you are mining, you might miss out.

Should you mine bitcoin?

You can make money mining bitcoin, and you can lose money too, so the best thing to do is to not rush into it. Do your research thoroughly, and learn as much as you can first.

If you are confident that you can make a profit, and will have the skills to run a bitcoin miner properly, it can be a lot of fun, and make you some money at the same time. Just dont go into it blind to the possibility that you might lose money. Learn about bitcoin, and the mining process before you rush out and buy a bitcoin miner, learn how to trade bitcoin so that you can pay for your running costs, learn all you can first.

Hopefully you will get back your return on investment BEFORE that happens! Good luck 🙂

  • Haroun Kola

    Stay away from cloud mining and especially dragon mining.

    • Yes, most cloud mining is a ponzi scheme, but people refuse to listen. https://www.bitcoinzar.co.za/what-is-bitcoin-cloud-mining/

    • Alan Goldberg

      What’s wrong with dragon Mining?

      • Dragon mining is a known ponzi scheme being pushed hard in South Africa by guys who have a history of signing up people to ponzi schemes disguised as ‘bitcoin mining’. We still get people contacting us from their last ‘bitcoin mining’ push who have lost hundreds of thousands of Rands, wanting us to help get it back.
        They lay it on thick, but at the end of the day, you are not mining, its all a facade to make you think you are mining bitcoin. If you want to be sure you are mining bitcoin, buy your own bitcoin mining hardware and plug it into the electricity in your own wall.
        I suggest you learn about cloud mining here https://www.bitcoinzar.co.za/what-is-bitcoin-cloud-mining/ If you see the checklist at the bottom and put dragon mining against it, they fail almost every point.
        The guys pushing it locally contacted me to try to get us to advertise it on our website (of course using their affiliate link so that they can make profit from every sign up) and when I gave them a list of things I needed them to provide to prove dragon mining was real, they were unable to do so. They eventually said they would get back to me with all the information in the next week….that was in October 2016, never hear from them again. Draw your own conclusions.

    • Schalk van der Merwe

      Dear Mr Kola, would you please elaborate your comment. I have been to one of the Dragon meetups and would like to get other opinions please.

      • Haroun Kola

        See @BitcoinZAR’s comment above. Any mining activity that has a recruitment model attached to it is highly suspicious. The process of mining and running a full node is mainly to keep the entire bitcoin and blockchain process secure and functioning.

        The more miners there are, the more the difficulty increases and you get less for your investment, so you’d expect miners would want less miners as competition instead of more.

        Watch the rest of the comments here and the promoters of Dragon Mine go to extreme length to try and convince everyone that the scheme is legit. If they are, why would they have to do so, unless its to convince another sucker to join their scheme, where the real income is from the investments of new investors to pay out old and existing ones.

        Do a search for “asicboost” and read a bit about the latest controversy around the scaling debate and ask yourself why you’d want to be part of all the drama when you can simply buy some bitcoin from https://luno.com, and wait for the price to rise before making a profit.

        Simple is sometimes best 🙂

  • Jeff

    Check new investment opportunities for the Information Technology industry, it’s better than any other really. You can earn BTC every 1 hour, very easy and working, good day to day profits simply and safely, try it (spam link removed)

  • Balikibaba

    For the record for anyone here, I launched Dragon Mine here in 2016.

    I sent this mail to the moderator of this site 4 days ago and have not received a response.

    Hi there

    Your opinion piece and advice to people on Dragon Mine refers.

    1. You refer to us as a cloud mine. Incorrect. We are a REAL MINE with REAL EQUIPMENT and I have personally been in the mine and have video and photographic evidence to prove it.
    2. You say the people running it here in South Africa have been known to push Ponzi schemes. Seeing as I launched it here, I would very much like to know what Ponzi scheme I have been involved in.
    3. Your checklist you refer to that you say we fail at almost every point, is incredibly untrue. I can prove that too.

    You have told a few people that the people who started it here have many times approached you to advertise on your website. I find that strange seeing as I only heard of you today and I am the person who launched it here. Or is it just your perception and assumption that the people who approached you are the people who launched it?

    I send this mail in good faith; not to argue. Having said that I would ask you to respond to me with what PROPER due diligence have you done on us? In order to satisfy my answers could you please simply respond to the following questions ( remember you have set yourself up as an expert and one to which people turn to for advice. Therefore I would encourage you to do this proper due diligence)

    1. Have you asked to visit our mine or seen live footage of several South Africans in it?
    2. Have you visited our MINING website to see said footage? If so, can you say what that website address is?
    3. Have you ever asked to speak to any of the proper leaders and myself ( Andrew Eaton) who launched it here before giving people your advice?
    4. Have you ever asked to speak to any of our executive team like David Martin our founder, Ken Brough, our CEO, or Randy Prince, our CFO?
    5. Are you aware that ONE HUNDRED percent of money spent on our mining contracts go towards the actual contract and that ZERO commission gets paid out from it?

    If your answers to above are “No” then can I highly suggest you do this seeing as though you are handing out advice to people?

    I welcome you to reach out to me, but also respectfully request that you refrain from calling us a Ponzi scheme until you have done so.

    Is that a fair suggestion and request?

    Regards

    Andrew

    With above being said I also welcome the opportunity to have a PUBLIC WEBINAR debate with both, the moderator of this site handing out poor advice on us, as well as Mr Haroun Kola. I will bring my A game and invite them to bring their A game. We can then let the public decide if we are fake or a ponzi.

    Sound fair?

  • Balikibaba

    Just to let everyone know I sent this mail to BitcoinZAR but he has not had the decency to respond, yet still feels it his right to judge our operation without any REAL facts. I HAVE the FACTS and am happy to have a public debate and let people decide for themselves.

    Hi there

    Your opinion piece and advice to people on Dragon Mine refers.

    1. You refer to us as a cloud mine. Incorrect. We are a REAL MINE with REAL EQUIPMENT and I have personally been in the mine and have video and photographic evidence to prove it.
    2. You say the people running it here in South Africa have been known to push Ponzi schemes. Seeing as I launched it here, I would very much like to know what Ponzi scheme I have been involved in.
    3. Your checklist you refer to that you say we fail at almost every point, is incredibly untrue. I can prove that too.

    You have told a few people that the people who started it here have many times approached you to advertise on your website. I find that strange seeing as I only heard of you today and I am the person who launched it here. Or is it just your perception and assumption that the people who approached you are the people who launched it?

    I send this mail in good faith; not to argue. Having said that I would ask you to respond to me with what PROPER due diligence have you done on us? In order to satisfy my answers could you please simply respond to the following questions ( remember you have set yourself up as an expert and one to which people turn to for advice. Therefore I would encourage you to do this proper due diligence)

    1. Have you asked to visit our mine or seen live footage of several South Africans in it?
    2. Have you visited our MINING website to see said footage? If so, can you say what that website address is?
    3. Have you ever asked to speak to any of the proper leaders and myself ( Andrew Eaton) who launched it here before giving people your advice?
    4. Have you ever asked to speak to any of our executive team like David Martin our founder, Ken Brough, our CEO, or Randy Prince, our CFO?
    5. Are you aware that ONE HUNDRED percent of money spent on our mining contracts go towards the actual contract and that ZERO commission gets paid out from it?

    If your answers to above are “No” then can I highly suggest you do this seeing as though you are handing out advice to people?

    I welcome you to reach out to me, but also respectfully request that you refrain from calling us a Ponzi scheme until you have done so.

    Is that a fair suggestion and request?

    Regards

    Andrew Eaton

    • Schalk van der Merwe

      Dear Webmaster, please stand up and defend your statement. I am busy trying to form an opinion and was about to kick Dragon/GalaxyLifestyle out the door till i read their response. They all provide contact numbers, names, where you are still anonymous. I saw the footage, and yes it could have been anyone’s miner farm, it is still a lot more evidence than what i saw in your post.
      Please don’t read my post as an attack on you, i don’t expect you to post your name or cell no here, but i would like to see your response, evidence, research, even a copy of the email you sent last year, the previous contact persons, anything.
      Full disclosure, i am NOT a miner or a current bitcoin user, yet, trying to form an opinion about Dragon vs Genesis, the problem is too many cloud mining scams have stained the market for the true mining companies.

      Dear Mr Eaton, would you mind responding to the list referred too (https://www.bitcoinzar.co.za/what-is-bitcoin-cloud-mining/). I read it and it does not seem unreasonable. I am not asking to defend yourself, simply a courtesy to help me and others form our own opinions. I have been to one of the seminars, i personally think they overcompensated for the networking scheme instead of focusing on the core, BitCoin mining, but after all my questions was answered I am about 90% convinced of the concept, just deciding if Dragon is the partner i want to use.

      If anyone want to contact me personally I am open to it, my email is [email protected] or my number is 072 437 7620.

      • Only saw the reply now, so will respond, in the meantime, maybe you should read about bitcoin mining schemes here: https://www.bitcoinzar.co.za/caution-bitcoin-mining-schemes-in-south-africa/

        • Balikibaba

          You still haven’t answered my questionson I posed. And I am willing to have a public debate with you on this. PUBLIC. You bring your A game and I will bring mine.

          • Relax man, it is not on the top of my priority list. Why don’t you make things faster if you are so eager, and list all your answers to every point in the scam checklist so long?

          • Balikibaba

            With due respect, I have responded with my questions to you. You are the one who has publicly accused our operation of being a scam without ANY PROPER due diligence, basing ALL your reasons on the ASSUMPTIONS that we tick all the boxes on your check list.

            You have NOT visited the mine like myself and several other South Africans have, and you have NOT bothered to contact me or any of the leaders to request to speak to our executive team. Something that could easily be arranged.

            With respect, having to defend ourselves against your baseless ASSUMPTIONS and accusations is also not on my priority list. It is not on my priority list because regardless of your baseless accusations I know who we are and know that we are a REAL mine with REAL equipment. I did NOT write my original post to you because I felt the need to defend ourselves. I wrote it to let people know that your write up on us is based 100% on assumptions and that you did ZERO due diligence on us. That is rather scary seeing as though you feel yourself fit to be handing advice on us out to people.
            I have asked you to answer my questions and I await a response.

            Telling someone (that you have accussed of being a scam artist) to relax, frankly, smacks of arrogance of the highest degree. I would like you to answer my questions.

          • Hey….

            1.You refer to us as a cloud mine. Incorrect. We are a REAL MINE with REAL EQUIPMENT and I have personally been in the mine and have video and photographic evidence to prove it.

            Firstly, a real mine with real equipment does not mean the hashing power covers the payouts, profits and costs of all the members, remember that. This is where most cloud mining companies start the ponzi / scam side of their business. The real money comes from recruiting other members, and building a matrix / binary tree / pyramid shaped funnel of ‘income’.
            These days with these type of ponzi schemes, there sometimes really is some token mining might be taking place, but they cant ever seem to prove they have enough hashing power to cover all the members.
            Most blockchain detective work on any payouts made by these companies prove the bitcoin made in payments to customers was NOT recently mined at all, is not new bitcoin, and is traced to a payment made to the company (probably from another user joining).
            Typically most payments going out to members can be traced to payments coming in from members….all your proof will help with this.
            Secondly, you ARE cloud mining. Bitcoin cloud mining usually refers to the process of Bitcoin mining using the shared processing power of a bitcoin miners at a remote data center. Instead of owning your own physical bitcoin mining hardware on your premises, you pay for bitcoin mining power provided by a bitcoin cloud mining company. This is basically what you are selling. If the miner is not in your house, if it is in a remote data center, its cloud mining.

            2.You say the people running it here in South Africa have been known to push Ponzi schemes. Seeing as I launched it here, I would very much like to know what Ponzi scheme I have been involved in.

            I know of some South Africans pushing this scheme, who HAVE been previously involved in the same type of mining scams in the past, where
            people lost a lot of money. These are the SAME people who had the same type of videos on youtube before encouraging people to join past failed scams. These are the same people / teams who when I would often comment on their videos and explain in great detail how they are wrong and are either being scammed, or they are scamming people, would disable the comments of the videos completely so that nobody else could read them.
            The same guy who is on what I think is the proper website for drangon mining as one of the directors, and is the same guy who refused to listen to reason, and thousands lost their money believing a previous bitcoin mining venture he was doing. Obviously it was not in his interestes to listen to reason and facts, when his paycheck is depending on people to continue putting in their money right? The same guy / group claims to OWN the mine in youtube videos, so yes, I ASSUME since they say they own the mine, the guy is in the videos, and his face is on the website, they are the people running it.

            3. Your checklist you refer to that you say we fail at almost every point, is incredibly untrue. I can prove that too.

            Please do prove it, starting with all the company information and official website etc, just so that we are all on the same page. Please can you do your best for all the points, so that we can all see which ones you pass and fail.
            You might not fail all, you might not pass all, but it will give an indication…even though that post is old, it has some valid points today. In addition, can you explain how you guys own the mine? How many PH do you have, and can you prove it? Can you provide an invoice showing the order of all the ASIC units, and or a letter from Jihan Wu for example saying they have provided X amount of power? What mining pool are you using, and what is username or user setup so that this can be verified? Can you provide your electricity bill to prove the power consumption corresponding to the amount of hashing power claimed? How many blocks are you mining per day on average? What is the bitcoin address the mined blocks are going to? Can you please sign a transaction from the address the bitcoin is getting paid to by the pool?

            You have told a few people that the people who started it here have many times approached you to advertise on your website. I find that strange seeing as I only heard of you today and I am the person who launched it here. Or is it just your perception and assumption that the people who approached you are the people who launched it?

            I said “The guys pushing it locally contacted me to try to get us to advertise it on our website”. My perception and assumption, is that the guy who I have seen in videos PUSHING it locally, and who has in the past been in other vidoes of KNOWN SCAM and PONZI websites, who disregarded warnings and sound advice to rather carry on pushing the scams until they collapsed, and who’s face is on what I think is the official website, is heavily involved in another scam / ponzi / MLM / pyramid scheme to get peoples money.

            I send this mail in good faith; not to argue. Having said that I would ask you to respond to me with what PROPER due diligence have you done on us? In order to satisfy my answers could you please simply respond to the following questions ( remember you have set yourself up as an expert and one to which people turn to for advice. Therefore I would encourage you to do this proper due diligence)

            My response is not a lot of PROPER due diligence on you, actually never heard of you. I really only know one face well, that is the one of the directors who I have referred to already. If you dont know already about these multiple bitcoin ponzi / scam websites this person has been involved in before, I suggest YOU do some proper due diligence on who you associate with. If you do know about all of the previous dubious dealings. If you do know about this past, then can you explain how you still have confidence to have a business venture with someone like this?

            1 Have you asked to visit our mine or seen live footage of several South Africans in it?

            No I have nor will ever ask to visit your mine. I have seen youtube footage of South Africans in what is supposed to be the same mine…specifically the same person who removed comments on their previous mine videos we made, who then removed all their videos on that cloud mining operation completely when everyone lost their money. Same guy who has his face on the website I saw for dragon mining.

            2 Have you visited our MINING website to see said footage? If so, can you say what that website address is?

            I dont know if I have visited the official website, hence me asking you for the address. The one I have seen is dragonminingsystems . com

            3 Have you ever asked to speak to any of the proper leaders and myself (Andrew Eaton) who launched it here before giving people your advice?

            No, based on my past experience with the director listed on the website I didnt see the point. You I have never heard of before.

            4 Have you ever asked to speak to any of our executive team like David Martin our founder, Ken Brough, our CEO, or Randy Prince, our CFO?

            No, and I don’t care to.

            5 Are you aware that ONE HUNDRED percent of money spent on our mining contracts go towards the actual contract and that ZERO commission gets paid out from it?

            That can be easily proven if you can prove a link from a customer buying hashing power, to the factory in China where their equipment they are buying is being shipped from. The bitcoin transaction details can be tracked to the purchase since it is so easily traceable. Can you also explain the licence to use the mine, different levels of affiliate commissions, and how / where that money all comes from?

          • Balikibaba

            Thank you.

            I have nothing to prove to you here. Thank you for confirming that you have not done proper due dilligence on us and that your advice and accusations are based on your assumptions.

          • Great “A game”, great public debate, thanks for answering all my questions, as I took the time to answer all yours. I have a whole bunch more when you finally decide to try and offer your proof.

            My advice is based on experience in the bitcoin space since 2011, being a bitcoin miner in the early days mining on pc, gpu mining, fpga, and also asic mining, and even early cloud mining. I know what I am talking about when it comes to mining bitcoin.
            My assumptions are based on my experience with bitcoin, past exposed scams, shady ‘leaders’ I contacted, (like the one on the website of yours I mentioned, which you did not dispute was yours), and the unhappy people who contacted me to try and get back their investments.

            If you are really a ‘good guy’ and this really a legitimate operation, there should be no problem at all providing all the proof, especially when it comes to the bitcoin transactions and blockchain forensics that can be done on the payments since we will be able to track all the payments on the blockchain.

            You should be incredibly eager to so, and it should be really easy to do it.
            Why you choose NOT to prove anything when you have the opportunity to on a bitcoin website, makes me think that you actually cant. This especially when a potential customer has come forward and asked you to please do that (Schalk).

          • Mikey

            Balikibaba, I would be most grateful if you could answer the questions posed by BitcoiinZAR. As a prospective investor I would like to see those answered in full – they could also help anyone else who may be undecided. if you have nothing to hide they should be easy to answer and I would think you would welcome the opportunity to dispel any misconceptions. People have tried to sell dragon mine to me and I had many of the same questions so this is a good platform to address them.

            Thanks a lot

          • Jonathan Hattingh

            Andrew, please answer BitcoinZAR’s questions. I am extremely interested to know the answers!

          • Schalk van der Merwe

            Pardon me to say something from the sideline again, kindly elaborate on your definition of a “cloud mining”.
            According to me (and from what is see many others also) cloud mining is derived from cloud hosting it is where numerous servers/mines are hosted in a central location, specifically where resources are shared/pooled as in your case. Similar to your product where i can reinvest my earnings and buy more hash power, it is referred to as a cloud or virtual mine. The opposite being a physical solution where if i buy a device and you put a sticker with my name on it i cannot get more output than the physical capacity of the device, if i want more i have to buy another device.
            Although you might dedicate a device to a user on purchase, all bonus and re-invested hashpower comes from pooled devices, the very definition of a cloud solution. I do find it unlikely that you give users dedicated devices since newer devices has an output of TH/s, not GH/s per your product.
            I am sorry that so many cloud solutions has been associated with Ponzi schemes, but referring to you as a cloud mine should in no way be seen as an insult.

          • Ponzi schemes need to look as legitimate as possible, every thing they do that can be seen as bad, needs to be removed, so that new ‘investors’ see nothing but good points and ‘proof’.

  • Richard

    im looking at building a 4 or 6 GPU rig (RX480) . what would the Bitcoin yield be per month (on average) for say a 4 GPU rig and a 6 GPU rig

    • francois

      Not enough….you will make more money by mining an alt-coin, and trading it for bitcoin, rather than mining bitcoin with that setup.

    • You should forget trying to mine bitcoin with GPU, rather mine alt coins and then trade them for bitcoin

      • osuya

        i need ur contact for some private chat on mining bitcon stuff. here is mine ; 08058407833

  • I absolutely loved this article, you guys should join this thread -> https://www.platinumwealth.co.za/forum/Thread-The-Bitcoin-thread so much knowledge you can add.

  • Mikey

    Hi. Looking forward to Andrew’s response to the interesting questions posed by Bitcoinzar a couple of months back re Lifestyle Galaxy’s mining.